Not many still remember the case. The Miracle Baby saga was a sensational case which enjoyed wide media coverage. It was handled by former Lagos State Chief Judge Justice Ayotunde Phillips, who retired last Saturday. In the case, a 65-year-old woman and a young girl lay claim to the maternity of little Bose, who became known as Miracle Baby. Justice Phillips ruled in favour of the young mother. She describes the matter as one of the most challenges in this interview with ADEBISI ONANUGA. She also speaks on challenges faced by the judiciary, such as corruption, delay in justice administration and the judiciary workers’strike.
In the course of your career, you must have been influenced by somebody. Who has been most influential in your life?
Yes, my father really. That is why I am fulfilled today and I thank him for that.
If you have not read law, what would you have studied in the university and how did your father influence your choice of study?
To be honest, before I went to the university I wanted to read History or just a general degree. I never thought of having a career but my father called me and said now you have passed your HSC, what do you want to do. I said I wanted to read History. He said no, that I should think of getting a profession. And that if I read History the best I could do was to get a master and lecture in the university but that if I choose a profession like Law, I could work for the rest of my life and the sky would be my limit. And I now realise that was a very good advice. So, he told me to read Law. In fact, he took my papers to the Faculty of Law to meet the Dean, who was then Dr. Elias and I was admitted to read Law and that is where it has found me today.
So, having read Law, why did you then take to the Bench as against the Bar where you normally find most budding lawyers?
To be honest, I thought that the Bench was too weak at a time and that I could do it differently and still do it well. So, my thought then was that “I’m going to vie for the Bench and do it as I see it fit’’. My father was a Judge. I more or less saw him working so I became attracted to adjudication and doing what is right. So, I said let me try this and do it my own way. That’s what made me come to the Bench, to be able to dispense justice, and dispense justice even with a human face. That the law and the rules on one side and common sense and decency on the other side and where the two meet you find that not only have you dispensed justice but that even the person who is found culpable, the person who is found liable, the person who is adjudicated as being wrong would know within himself or herself that he or she is wrong. And I’ve had a couple of cases like that in my career where the defence lawyers even said we thank you my Lord, we would abide by your decision. And only a few of them went on appeal, most of them accepted what I did because they trusted it and they knew in themselves that what I did was not wrong. So, that was my reason of taking to the Bench and I’m very fulfilled in that I’ve come, you can still be friendly, approachable, you can still live your life and still do justice and have people respect your decisions. That was why I joined the bench and I think I’ve done it my own way and so far, I’ve not got too many negative reports.
Being on the Bench is one thing but getting to the pinnacle of one’s career is another. How did you feel the day you were sworn-in as the Chief Judge of the Lagos State by Governor Babatunde Fashola (SAN) two years ago?
I felt very fulfilled, it just shows that you don’t have to lobby, you don’t have to make a nuisance of yourself as it were. If you trust in God and you do your work properly and you keep above boards, you don’t get involved in any scandal, and in Lagos State, it is done by seniority. Once you get to that point where you are number two and you are younger than number one, you will definitely succeed number one. And that’s why I thank the Lagos State Judiciary so much because we have it in place, there’s no hop, step and jump. You wait for your turn. When your turn comes, you will be the Chief Judge in so far the person ahead of you is not younger than you. If the person ahead of you is younger than you, definitely you will retire before you get there. But if the person is older than you, definitely you will get there and you would be fulfilled and then you will be able to contribute your quota not only on the bench as a judge but administratively because you are going to wear three caps. You are going to wear the political cap because it’s a political office, you are going to wear the administrative cap and then still be a serving judge. And I felt very good, very fulfilled and I was glad that I would be able now to contribute again in my own way and my own little bit to the administration of justice in Lagos State in particular and in Nigeria in general.
It has never been a smooth ride for those at the top. What would you say have been the challenges you encountered as a Chief Judge?
My first challenge was with the union, Judicial Staff Union of Nigeria (JUSUN). It was then led by Mr. Adekanye and he came into my chambers and said: “Excuse me, you know you’ve been a good mummy to all of us. I just came to tell you that we have a nagging problem about N10,000 allowance” and that if I didn’t find a way of paying that allowance they were ready to down tools. That happened even before I was sworn in. In fact, it was as soon as I was announced as successor to my predecessor. They came to welcome me and then he brought a long list of demands, the chief of which was the N10,000 allowance.
He said I should leave other demands to give priority to allowance issue, and threatening to go on strike if they were turned down. He said: “We know you are our mummy but when a child is hungry, he doesn’t know any mummy. That was my first challenge, how am I going to pay this N10,000. So, I called one or two of the principal officers then, Mr. Safari now Justice Safari, who was the Chief Registrar and we had a discussion then. So, I called the person in charge of money and asked how much we get every month, he told me and I said go and calculate how much it will be to pay all the staff N10,000. He calculated it to be a sizeable sum and I said I have to pay that money to give myself peace and make my children happy. You know we mothers, we have to be very careful before we think about ourselves, we have to think about our children. Once your child is happy, he would do well in school and you too will be happy. And I asked is it okay for me to take that money, and they said yes, the money is ours. I will decide how it’s going to be spent. And I said from this minute pay them the N10,000 each. And within three weeks of my being sworn-in, I was sworn-in on June 14, 2012, so the money was for June salary. So, three weeks later they got the alert and they came to my office prostrating, kneeling down and that’s where their prayers for me started. And I don’t think they have stopped those prayers for now. I wake up in the morning I pick my phone prayers from anonymous numbers praying for me, for my children, and my children’s children. So, that was my first challenge and since that time I had no problem with them at all. The atmosphere is calm, even the strike they are on now, they came to explain to me that they are very sorry but it is for the betterment of the Judiciary and it is something they have to do but that it will not disrupt activities marking my retirement. And they all turned up en masse for the novelty match, they have really honoured me. They’ve spoken so well about me in all nooks and crannies of this country. When I meet other sister Chief Judges, they ask me what are you doing in Lagos that they love you so much and I say I don’t know, maybe it is the N10,000 allowances. But I thank God. That was my only challenge that I had.
To what extent did your decision affect your budget?
When you are at the helm of affairs, you have to make decision. And you make decisions not to please yourself or make yourself comfortable because as a leader you are really a servant. And I always say to be a good leader, you have to be a good servant because you are serving the people whom you are leading indirectly. If they are not happy, you are not happy. Everybody knows that we are taking these chunks from our running cost and we are making do with the rest. So, we are blocking holes here and there, say let’s do this, we pay half now and balance later and so on. So, we found out that we’ve been able to manage things. It has been rough this year because last year globally, I think the estimated revenue did not come in and so every department of government have suffered the cost. No new contract has been awarded; the emphasis now is on completing the on-going projects, more so, as the government is going to change hands next year at the executive level. So all of us are going to take the cut and when you take your cut, you cut your coat according to the cloth or size and make do with what you have. So, I’m not finding it too difficult but I’ve not done much as I would have loved to do. I had to abandon a few of my ideas but in my handing over note, I am going to put those ideas down for the incoming Chief Judge. If she thinks they are worthy, she can take them up. There are so many things we want to do like the ceremonial court. We should stop going to Igbosere for valedictory and all that. In the courts they are building now, there is a special ceremonial court, a huge court where all the judges would sit, the public would sit in the gallery, there will be changing room for judges and lawyers, there will be toilet facilities, there will be a restaurant where you can have refreshments after. So, we are building that, we’ve started that, the governor has approved it and they’ve given us land for that. So, that’s a project I would have loved to start, lay the foundation and all that but government’s work is continual, you can’t do it all. Even if I have five years as Chief Judge, I’m sure I will still leave a lot behind; there will still be a lot to be done.
We have the Tapa Commercial Court project that will cost about N1.5 billion, where all the commercial court would be is where the Tapa Magistrate Court is now. It will have courtrooms, libraries, restaurants, changing rooms, judges’ recreation rooms, conference rooms. That one is on course, the file actually has gone to the governor but it has not been approved yet because there’s no money for it in the budget. So, that is also pending and there are so many things still pending because of finance, may be when the Judiciary becomes autonomous we would be able to do things on our own.
What are some of the innovations and reforms you introduced into the justice delivery system?
I’m sure you’ve heard of the Judicial Information System, it was started by my predecessor. The contract was awarded before I came on board and they have started to put the infrastructure in place but I just made sure that the whole system was put in place properly and became functional. So now lawyers can file from their offices. But for now, it is just that they can’t pay yet because there are still issues with the Naira Master Card due to some technical things that only accountants can understand. But at least lawyers can access the website, upload their documents and then come to pay for them in the court.
The libraries are now been upgraded as I speak, the contracts have been awarded. Igbosere has started to work, Ikeja is yet to start but the money has been given for them to upgrade. All the judges and magistrates, I made sure that they are all gadget compliance as I call it. I’m an IT savvy person. I love gadgets, my I-pad is my fifth child, I carry it around with me anywhere I go I read my speeches from my I-pad, all the judges have Ipads, all the magistrates have gadgets. And then, at the magistracy, I’m trying to enforce and implement the 2009 Magistrates Court Laws. If you notice, the latest thing we have done is that all of them are now wearing robes. So, just a few of the things I’ve mentioned, we have done to uplift the Lagos State Judiciary and even make it greater. And I was telling the governor when he came in last week to commission the Achieve and that’s the last thing I’ve done. The Achieving of all our files, put all our files in the achieve, put them online so that any time you want access information on any file in respect of any case, it would be easily accessible. We won’t dumb them in one room where rats and cockroaches will be feeding fat on them. We now had to preserve our documents, you know our documents are very, very important. So, you find that these are things we have put in place to make sure that the Lagos State Judiciary is above all.
So, my vision for the Lagos State Judiciary in some five, ten years is that they should demolish some building in Ikeja here and build high rise courtrooms, state of the art courtrooms, conference rooms, waiting rooms, restaurants, family courts and things like that. We’ve started work on the Family Court too, we’ve got land for that too so that where they build the ceremonial court there would be Family Court too. So, we would have special court for family matters just like we are going to have special court for commercial matters. All these I’ve laid the foundation for and I hope my successor would build on it.
Why is prison congestion still a problem despite the efforts of your administration to decongest prisons in Lagos State?
I really don’t know but I’ve thought about it. In May this year, myself and members of the Judicial Service Commission went to the United Kingdom to talk to our counterparts over there . I really thank God for that trip, it was arranged for us by a company here in Nigeria. It was a beautiful experience. In England, they have ‘Sentencing Guidelines’. When the man showed us the book, it was very voluminous and I’m not exaggerating. Sentencing Guidelines where they have envisaged every single, possible eventuality that can come up in a criminal case. The Guideline says Magistrates and Judges should do and handle cases, when this happen do this, when that happens do that. I think we need something like it here and we need real guidelines too. I tried to work on it but I was so busy doing so many things and my time was too short, so my successor would have to handle that. We need to put special guidelines for our magistrates. Of course, the police have their own fare of the blame, so do we as judicial officers. There are certain defendants that should not go into prisons. With the community service, the probation, all those new innovation that has been introduced by the Criminal Administration of Justice Law in Lagos State 2011 those are the things we need to look into now and utilize to the maximum to ensure that we don’t congest the prisons.
Some of you follow me when I go on prisons decongestion visit, the least I ever released from any prison is 50 but by the time I’m leaving another 75 are going in. The people appreciate what I’m doing but I think there’s something wrong with the system and we need to address that. So, I think with a Sentencing Guidelines, bail guidelines, full implantation of the new features introduced by the Criminal Administration of Justice Law in Lagos State 2011 and above all training and further training and more training of our judges and magistrates on this issue, we should be able to conquer it. But right now, we seem to be using the backroom to win the war.
What has been your experience with the judicial staff, the judges, and magistrates?
I have received maximum cooperation from them. You know where you have a lot of women it is always very difficult. But as woman, I have not had any problem with any of them. You might know that I have an open door policy, so when a judge or magistrate comes to my chambers you can come in without being announced and discuss any problem at all, personal, official or other problem can be discussed with me. And they see me more like a big sister. Those who are much younger see me like a motherly figure while those of my contemporaries see me like a big sister and we speak honestly to ourselves. If I receive report about anyone of them, I summoned the person to chambers and we talk heart-to-heart and tell them how I feel and let them know how I would have handle the situation and they listened. So, I have had no problem whatsoever with them, I am very, very happy. I really appreciate the cooperation I received from every single one of them, the males and the females, the judges and magistrates. And I hope that they would give my successor the same cooperation and love they have shown me. I have had really a good time with them and I really appreciate them.
Corruption has been a major problem in Nigeria, as a stakeholder in the Judiciary how do you think the problem of corruption can be addressed in the Judiciary?
There are two parts of the judiciary, the judicial officers and the support staff. As regards the judicial officers just make them comfortable. In Lagos State Judiciary now in my two years tenure, no judge or magistrate was reported to me on the allegation of corruption. There was an instance I must confess and we dealt with the situation and the magistrate has been separated from the service when we find out that the complaints were getting too much and some of the allegations confirmed to be true. But apart from that, I have had no problem whatsoever with my judicial staff. In respect of the support staff, there are still one or two bad eggs that we have heard reports of. Some of them have been removed for bad behavior;, one or two that were caught with their hands in the cooking jars as they say, those two have also been separated from the service. We still have this nagging problem because even just yesterday the Code of Conduct Bureau Commissioner and Director informed me that some people are still taking money from those who want to sign Code of Conduct forms. I have asked the Chief Registrar to look into it because we are yet to identify whether it is our staff or some touts. You know we still have problem of touts. But luckily for us, the Judicial Information System has removed the issue of signing affidavit and that kind of thing as far as the High Court is concerned. I will not deny that the problem might persist but the best way to tackle it is to tackle it head on and once you catch anybody you deal with that person accordingly. By the time two, three persons lost their jobs, it will send a lesson to others to stop.
But generally, in Nigeria workers are not very happy with their remunerations. There’s need for total and thorough overhaul of the public service salary structure to meet the present day Nigeria. We all go to the same market and we still buy the same gari, tomatoes and pepper. So, government need to take the welfare of the workers more seriously, once that is done I’m sure to most people, except you are born greedy or a born criminal, you will not need to be corrupt, extort money or to steal. If you have good salary, nice place to stay in and of course good transport to and from work. I think government still need into the welfare of the workers when that is done there will be less fraud.
Don’t you think there’s need to also look at the appointment of those who are being appointed to the Bench as a way of curbing corruption?
Yes, we need to appoint judges now on merit and when I say merit, you don’t need to be brilliant alone, you need to have a character that is above boards. The Constitution provides that any legal practitioner who is ten years at the bar and above is eligible for appointment as a judge. In ten years, if you bring a private practitioner or even you’ve been working with the ministry or a corporation or a bank or wherever you may be, you would have acquired your reputation. And if there’s any coma, any black spot in that person’s reputation you are automatically disqualified from being considered a judge. But you know in Nigeria today, you might want to go by merit and somebody come to say this is my brother, he wants to be a judge because we want a judge in our family and they just put him there without even him being tested. And of course, when you get the wrong people on the Bench you are going to get bad report about that person. They say one bad apple spoils the whole apples, the judicial appointments are very sensitive. Once one is tainted, it will taint everybody. They will say that’s how they are. The Lord is elevating you by making you a judge, the Lord is elevating you above your peers, you are going to be adjudicating over your peers. In order to do this, no bad words must be said about you because once you are bad then you don’t belong to the class of people who are to adjudicate and to find your fellow citizens wrong.
So, the appointment process, I must say that the NJC has put guidelines in place. In fact, one of the guidelines that surprised me when I saw it was that the governor is not to be involved in the process at all. Is there in the guidelines. So, they’ve done their best to make it transparent but you know the Nigerian factor. Because the same governor who is not supposed to be involved in the process will still be the one to approve the appointment and even swear them in. All the NJC does is to say Chief Judge Lagos we approved your list then I will send the list to the governor. If the governor does not like say number six on the list what should we do? We are stuck. He would say I’m not going to swear in number six. So, we still have to look at the process of appointment of judges.
In my father’s day, because I remembered how my father did it many times in my presence. He would call a lawyer and say Mr. X I’ve noticed the way you comported yourself in my court, I’ve noticed the way you handled your cases and I’ve seen that you have appeared before me in several matters, would you like to be appointed a High Court Judge? That’s how it was done in the good old days. When it comes to the legal profession, I am a traditionalist, I believe in tradition because that is what separates the legal profession from any other profession. And that’s why we call it the Noble profession. But with politics and politicians here and there, I must confess we are not getting the best people on the bench.
Talking about tradition, would you approve of female wearing trousers in the Bar?
Oh yes, there is no male or female at the Bar, we are all gentlemen of the Bar. There’s nothing wrong with that, it is what is in your brain, how you can present your case. Just dress formally, I approve wholeheartedly.
There has been agitation for total independence of the Judiciary. Would you say Lagos State has been able to achieve this?
Well I will say 75 per cent not totally. In fairness to Lagos State Governor, Babatunde Fashola (SAN) I’ve rarely ask for anything and he does not give but we still have to line up with other ministries and parastatals to collect money. That situation, may be, should stop. That is why the present strike action that is on-going is well structured, is well thought of, is well founded and is on very strong ground. The court has even now ruled that we must be independent and the relevant sections of the Constitution must be complied with. So, we should be independent so we can handle our own projects ourselves, we can spend our own money ourselves and of course any Chief Judge, or Chief Registrar or Director of Finance and Admin who meddles with government funds will just have to face the music. There’s only one thing that reminds me to be in the Judiciary, reminds me to put the proper departments in place because when now you are going to handle projects, you are going to need engineer, you are going to need quantity surveyors, so maybe we may have to work something out with the Ministry of Works by way of consultancy. But the Constitution states clearly that we should be independent. Even people have stated reasons that we should be at par so when we are adjudicating we shouldn’t think that if I do this thing against the governor I may not get the money we have requested for a particular project. So, things like that. Our capital project is what is left for us to handle on our own. Monthly running cost we get our money, we run the court. It’s just the capital projects that we are yet to handle on our own in Lagos State. So, I very much support it and it’s the constitutional provision and we have to obey the Constitution of the land.
You have been on the Bench for a very long time as a judge and as the Chief Judge, from your experience, how can we eliminate delays in our criminal justice system?
When I was appointed in 1994, we were then still living in the dark ages, we were writing in long hand, no computerization, no power, sometimes you can’t sit in court for a week because of no power. Then the salary was about N4,800 per month it was terrible. Then we were operating the 1994 Rules. But with time, we got the new Rules 2000 and then Justice Sotiminu came on board as the Chief Judge and we started using 2004 Rules and that’s where things began to change. Then we had front loading of our processes and then computers. I think I was about the first person to start using a laptop. In 1997, a friend of mine Mrs. Joseph called me one day and said you still have a long time on the Bench, is this how you are going to be writing? You will kill yourself, for 20years you will be writing and by the time you are leaving your hand would have folded. So, she was making fun of me and she said she just bought a Toshiba laptop and that I should go and buy one and call one of these young men to teach me how to use it. So, I asked the guy who was taking me for exercise if he knows somebody who does computer and he said yes that there was somebody in his church. So, when the guy came to see me he said My Lord don’t start with laptop, start with a desktop, that is how to start learning. So, that is how he taught me how to use computer and I was using one hand. But one day my son, saw me and say mummy use the two hands, how long will it take you to write a judgment with one hand. So, that was how I started using the two hands. And that’s how I started on my own to make the job more interesting for me.
Now when the 2004 Rules came on board, we now know everybody needed to know more about computer. I remember Justice Ade Alabi the two Chief Judge ahead of me, arranged for us o go for computer classes in Alausa at the Computer Centre and we all went one by one. And some of the older judges couldn’t really pick it up but we the younger ones quickly picked it. And when the Millennium judges came on board from 2001, then we now have some young minds, fresh young bloods and everybody is using computer. You will find out that all of us are now using computers and laptops now. It was very bad, very difficult then but now it is much easier, even the lawyers all of us are now computer literate. The rules even demand that you must know how to use computer otherwise, you won’t be able to work well.
On the issue of importance of training for judicial officers, how much training was organized for them during your tenure?
I’ve organized a lot, we’ve trained a lot. First of all, from our annual retreat, the judges go on retreat every year so do the magistrates. We get resource persons to talk to us about our health or topical issues. For the magistrates believe it or not criminal matters and land loads and tenants. For the judges, they talked to us about the new Rules, how to enforce the Rules and things like that. And then we’ve done training for the Registrars, both here and a few of them abroad. We couldn’t really afford to send too many abroad but some of them have gone abroad even for management training and all that. I’ve tried to emphasise a lot on training, especially the Registrars during vacation like this, this is time when the Registrars can benefit from training because the courts are not sitting. I think in my first year some of them went to Ghana and the magistrates too. We have done quite a bit on training; we have done a lot of conferences abroad and locally for the judges, magistrates and even registrars. Not everybody because we couldn’t afford it but as many we could accommodate.
How do you relax while on the bench despite your tight schedule?
I watch movies, I have what they called Apple TV and I downloaded all my favourites series like Law and Order. It’s terrible, this job has affected me; anything legal is what I watch now – I watch Law and Order, Bursting Legal, The Brief – all those legal programmes; I’ve downloaded them all onto my laptop and I use Wi-Fi to screen it to my television. That’s how I relax. I sit down, put my feet up with a cup of tea may be some biscuits. That’s my main form of relaxation, watching movies and watching those programmes.
So, MiLord, how do you intend to spend your retirement?
I’ve been working non-stop for 40 solid years. I was called to the bar in June of 1974 straight to Youth Corps, that one is work not enjoyment. Came back from Youth Corps in June of 1975, got married in October of 1975 and I’ve started working. Throughout my pregnancy I was working. My daughter was two months old when I began work again in LSDPC in 1977. So, everyday I’d woken up in the morning to go to work except for when I’m on vacation and that is just two, three weeks in a year. So, I’m looking forward very much to waking up in the morning and having absolutely nothing to do because it’s strange to me. I still woke up this morning to come here. My children are actually worried about me I must confess. Because they believe it’s going to affect me. They say what are you going to do with yourself mummy? I said of course, I’m going to enjoy myself and lie down and be totally jobless for once in my life. And then I will travel, I want to go back to Australia and explore those places I’ve been hearing about, I will travel. I want to go away on holiday and not know when I will come back. Out of all my friends I’m the only one that is still working, all of them have retired and they are waiting for me.
I was worried at first I must confess. Six, seven months ago that please I’m going to retire, what am I going to do but now I can see a beautiful life for myself after retirement. You know they say that rest is sweet after labour, I have labored, I’m now going to rest and enjoy
Which of the cases you handled did you find most challenging?
I found the Miracle Baby case a bit challenging. I did the Miracle Baby case and it was quite challenging. And then I’ve done some land matters. I’ve done one recently, I delivered the judgment about two, three weeks ago where we had about 26 witnesses and we had several legal issues. The judgment runs into about 90 pages, I delivered it about three weeks ago just before the vacation started.
For the land matter, two contending parties all bought land from one family and each one says the land is mine, the claimant says the land was his, the defendant too says the land was his. You know land matters are always intricate, a lot of issues come that has to be considered and I found that very challenging. As I was writing the judgment, you get to understand the issues involved. But for the Miracle Baby case, in particular I think more because of the outside attention. There was a lot of media attention and I refused to talk to the press, I refused to appear on the television, in fact I drove them from my court that they should not come into my court. That was challenging but I was glad that at the end of the day, the person who I found to be the mother of the child was the true mother of the child because you could even see from the facial resemblance. And the mother still sees me and she will come to introduce herself. So, those were some challenging cases.
So, which is your memorable day on the Bench?
I think the day I was sworn-in as a Chief Judge because that was a beautiful day. The day I could stand up before everybody and give my assurance speech to say I would do this and I would do that and the Lord blessed my utterances on that day because most of the things I said I would do I have done. What I’ve not completed at least I have started. Because that was the icing on the cake, like you’ve worked for all these years, I could stand there, I was not sick, I was not blind and they did not manage to carry me there, I stood there in good health and besides God see me through it all. I think that was a memorable day for me.
Also, what would you like to be remembered for apart from being a Chief Judge with human face?
I want to be remembered for doing things differently. I think I’ve been different from those that have preceded me. I want to be remembered for my unique way of approaching the administration of justice. Above all, I want to be remembered for having come to make my mark. I don’t like to sing my praises because I really don’t know how to do it but at the end of the day I want history to judge me and I hope history will give me a pass mark.
What was your first day in court as a counsel like?
I remember that day clearly. I appeared before Justice Agoro with Mr. Kehinde Sofola. In the car on the way to the High Court, he told me I was going to move the motion. I will never forget that day in my life. I said move motion; when you leave the Law School you don’t really know how to do these things. He then said it’s very easy, you will just say My Lord; this application is brought pursuant to section so so. And as he was talking, I was writing everything. But when we got to court, I thought he was joking that he just wanted me to be prepared. But as Justice Agoro came in, he announced me and said My Lord; my learned friend, Mrs. Olagbende is going to move the application. And I said to myself, this man is serious, so I quickly took that paper and I began to move the motion. Then when I finished I said I so moved My Lord and I sat down. The judge knew me of course because my father was a serving judge. He said well done, is this the first time you are moving? I said yes My Lord. Then Mr. Sofola said you’ve done very well you deserved a gift for that. That was my first day in court.
What is your view on the abolition of death sentence?
I don’t think death sentence does anyone any good unless the crime committed has been particularly in heinous, that the person does not deserve to live in the society. The greater thinking now is that death sentence should be abolished and I think they should commute it to life sentence. I was asking the Comptroller of Kirikiri Maximum Security Prison on one of my visits there, when last did they carry out execution, he said it has been a long time because the governor has to sign and I don’t think any governor in recent time has sign it. So, I think it is gradually going out of fashion. In Lagos State, this is the second term of Governor Fashola and I don’t think he has signed any death warrant for anybody to be executed. I think it’s dying on its own; they should just let it die and commit it to life sentence.
Do you have any regret as you bow out of office?
Do I have any regret? I don’t have any regret. I believe the time given to me to serve as Chief Judge is what God has given to me. Some people would say they would like to stay for five years, they would like to stay for 10 years, I believe it is not how long you do a thing but how well. You can be there for six months and make a monumental impact than somebody who has been there for 10 years. And you can be there for 10 years and do nothing tangible. I have no regret, I have come, I have played my part and it is time to leave and I believe I want to leave graciously and I’m bowing out graciously. I’m very, very happy with my career so far and I thank God for giving me long life and good health and I ask for more that I could even enjoy a longer life now in retirement.
How did you end up being a judge?
I was born on July 25, 1949 in London, England where my parents were studying at the time. When my father finished reading Law in 1959, as it was done in those days, he immediately returned to Nigeria, and started working in the Federal Ministry of Justice as a counsel.
So, I had my nursery and part of my primary education in England. When we came back in 1959, I attended Ladi Lak School in Yaba for two years, the latter part of 1959 to 1961. I passed a common entrance examination in 1961 and in 1962 I gained admission into Queens College. And I was in Queens College, Yaba till 1966 when I did my school certificate examination.
I left Queens College and went off to Ibadan Grammar School, where I did my Higher School Certificate (HSC) examination and that’s where my life took a radical posture. Then there was a different phase of my life all together. I was in Ibadan Grammar School between 1966 to 1968, I then moved to University of Lagos in 1969, read Law, passed out in 1973 with an honours degree. Then I went to the Law School from 1973 to 1974 and I was called to Bar in June 1974. By that time, the Youth Corps Scheme had caught up with us and so we were the first set of lawyers to do Youth Service. I was posted to the then East Central State. So what you have now as Abia, Imo, Ebonyi, Enugu and all that was all one state under Ukpabi Asika. He was then the administrator. So, I was posted to Enugu Ministry of Justice as a state counsel for one year. I came back to Lagos in 1975, worked for some time in Kehinde Sofola Chambers and joined Lagos State Development and Property Corporation (LSDPC) from 1976 to 1977, and rose from Legal Officer to Secretary and Legal Adviser. Then I decided in 1990 to move to the Ministry of Justice in order to get to the High Court because ordinarily, I won’t be appointed from LSDPC. And so in 1990, I moved to Ministry of Justice; I was Director of Commercial Law for two years and in 1992 to 1994 I became Director of Civil Litigation and in February of 1994, I was appointed a High Court Judge. That’s my life in a nutshell. I’m married to Mr. Folorunsho Phillips, he lives in America. We have four children and four grandchildren, all boys. So, I’m begging them to give me a grand daughter.
