General Overseer of The King’s Chapel Ibadan, Rev. (Dr) Lekan Babatunde, was a former lecturer at the University of Ibadan. He speaks with Sunday Oguntola on his exploits in the ministry and sundry issues. Excerpts:
Who did you find yourself in the ministry?
I studied Hospital Management and Philosophy in the US. When I came back, I was working in UCH for some time. I was in charge of the clinical services but I wasn’t fulfilled. Then I decided to go back to the academics.
By His grace I happened to be a brilliant student. As a matter of fact, I went to the US with the Federal Government scholarship. When I got to UI and they saw my performance, they offered me a teaching job straightaway.
Even my first degree was in teaching as a graduate assistant. But the call of God upon me was so urgent that I had to leave and submitted my PhD thesis to United Bible University in Lagos. Then after I taught in UI for four years, I abandoned it for full- time ministry.
Philosophers and theologians hardly meet. How did you cope?
That is true but don’t forget God can do all things. When He needs you, He takes you. He takes you even if you were born by atheists. He still takes you and uses you regardless of the philosophical background. When it has to do with my God, philosophy bows. God is first and any philosophical theory bows.
When it comes to priority, the word of God is above all and philosophical theory comes next.
How did the call come, was it when you are in UI?
From my childhood, I have always known that God was going to use me. One of the very unfailing experiences I had that authenticated the call was when I was visiting my aunt in Abeokuta. All of a sudden, I was about to enter the house and three big angels appeared to me. They were very big and massive not standing vertically.
They were standing horizontally. Then all of a sudden the one in the third position flew to number one and was facing me as if to give a message. But as an immature Christian, I just shouted to my aunt to come and see angels. By the time she rushed down to look, they had vanished.
One time again, I was going to my place of work in UCH and at the secretariat roundabout, I met this crippled guy. Something in me just said ‘go and help that man.’
I knew it was God asking me to pray for him but I was afraid. I thought suppose I pray for this man and nothing happened. I ignored it and left. I got to my place of work. I could not do anything. The burden was so overwhelming to the extent that my boss asked what the problem was.
So I went back to pray for him. Just like Acts 3, he stood up and walked. All those were among the signs. The third one that actually pushed me was that of a girl called Agatha, who was dead in the house opposite us in Bodija.
My daughter was there because we heard weeping and she said, ‘daddy something is telling me Agatha will rise up.’ So, I went there and prayed for her. In fact, they have brought the ambulance that will take her to the mortuary. She woke up and the parents started coming to church.
With all these happening one after the other, I was doing God’s work part time but I said no more. No more philosophy, no more teaching. Then I tendered my resignation and left the university services.
And would you say you are fulfilled in full time ministry?
I wouldn’t say that because each time I looked at what I have done and what is still ahead, it is like I am still like 10 percent. I am not fulfilled yet but I am satisfied that I answered His call. I have no regret because there is still a long way to go.
But some people would say if you are still in the academics, you certainly would have become a professor.
My students are professors and of course I know.
Do you look back and say I wished I was on the other side?
To be sincere, once in a while when you meet one or two challenges, I will say to myself, ‘if I were still in the academics I will have become a professor by late 90s or early 2000’. But I will quickly repent and apologise to God.
So once in a while that happens especially when you see your colleagues that you are more even brighter than. We are human beings. It is only God that has no fault and we all stand by His grace.
Are you pleased with Christianity today?
When we were coming up as believers, we knew how the body of Christ was. When you do business with a Christian then, you can sleep at ease. You leave your property or wife with any Christian in those days and it just will not occur to you that something could go wrong.
You don’t have to do that today. Things have changed drastically. It is painful when you try to say let’s go back to the drawing table and then put off what needs to be put off. You offend some people who think you are old school. Some would think that things have changed that it is not what it should be.
So it is a lot of frustration but one thing is certain the Christianity practiced today is not what the fathers handled over to us. Today, people run after signs and wonders.
But are you not old school?
That is the frustration I get all the time. Jet age and all those have changed things but we still try to maintain God’s standards. God does not change. Countries change and Presidents changes but God remains the same. He is still the old school God. He has not been modernised and they need to understand and face that reality.
Do you get insinuations that your church is not massive because of your stance?
I do but one has stood tall and counted the costs. For me, it is either you are moving with the crowd or God. I am not even moved by what they are saying. It doesn’t even bother me a bit.
But these days every pastor wants a mega church?
Yea
Not having one doesn’t move?
At all
Why?
I am not moved because we are not in the days of numbers. I don’t even give it a thought.
Some people will also point Jesus had a crowd-pulling ministry.
He had a crowd pulling ministry but at the end of the day, how many people remained? He met with thousands but at the end of the day, 500 were left and he gave them instructions.
At the end, only 120 in the Upper room received the Holy Ghost. So if I had 10,000 people and 900 go to heaven, I’m just deceiving myself. But if I have 1000 and I take all to heaven, is that not a great work? That is the way to look at it.
Some people will say your disposition is why there is no financial prosperity to show
Of course, you count the costs before you go ahead. All these I have counted and I am ready for. It doesn’t bother me as long as the bible says godliness with contentment is a great gain. As long as it befits God, it befits me. He takes care of me. He meets my needs and that is all I am after.
But sometimes when you have needs, does it come to your mind it couldn’t have happened if you had a 1000- seater congregation?
Because we are human beings, we are flesh and blood, it comes. But like David, I say my soul be still. Certainly when I see some of my colleagues that don’t understand the Scriptures as you do, they have not seen the signs and wonders that you see and they can boast of millions, you begin to wonder if there is anything wrong with you. But then you count the costs and you talk to yourself.
Is it that you have been hiding all these years?
It is not that I have been hiding. I tried as much as possible to do things at God’s pace and whatever He asks me to, I do. It is not that I have been hiding but I am just not noisy.
By nature?
By nature and even the things of God are not noisy.
You have been in full time ministry since 1987. How many branches does your church have?
We used to have many across the country, even outside the country. But we shut them down because of the frustration. So I said we need to go back to the drawing table so that if we need to take 100 or 1000, we know that these are the ones going to heaven.
I called all parish pastors to retreat to the headquarters and those that wanted to leave should feel free to.
And then people left?
Yes.
Why?
It is one of those problems that this one does not want to change at all or is too rigid. I heard a very honest man of God preached one time. He said if we were to go back to those messages we used to preach in those days, we will lose all of these big congregations.
And I agree we will lose two-third of them and I know what he was saying because I used to know them even before I became a pastor. I used to follow them to meetings and all. But it is not everybody that is ready to pay the price, which is too bad.
If you have done over 30 years of preaching, you should have ministers coming for guidance
That is the thing about it again. Those people, even if they are not doing the right thing, they know how to talk. They come but sometimes they don’t listen. They recognise me. They know I am different but they may not change.
When you shut down the branches locally and overseas, did some people wonder if you were okay?
A friend called me from Italy and said ‘Rev, you have to take it easy. We can still go ahead and make corrections.’ One of the things that really pushed me to do was our church is a conservative one.
It‘s not that we don’t believe in prosperity, faith, miracles and all those things. But we are not all out there for considering prosperity as the end. They are means to whatever you want to achieve.
I started seeing strange things in our branches. In one of our conventions, there was choreography. I was put off by the dancing steps and all that. I said it is better we come back and look at where we have started. But the pastors didn’t feel that way and left.
